Web Updates does not work

[ccarras]

I am creating a Web Based installation.

The initial installation runs fine without any problems. However I am having problems when I create a Web Update and upload the files to my website and run the update executable. The setup program runs and seems to do something but in the end it leaves the files I had before; nothing has been updated.

I Have the IA version that comes with Delphi 2007.

Here is what I am doing (full URLs are not listed for security):

Initial setup
1) Set version to 1.0.0.0
2) Checked receive application updates and set the URL to: http://.../Software/updates.txt (Changed the extension to .txt)
3) Added files to be installed
4) Created a Shortcut pointing to $UNINSTALLLINK$ at $SHORTCUTFOLDER$ to run update. After installation this creates a shortcut with target: "C:\\Documents and Settings\\All Users\\Application Data\\{66C6CBA4-BE7D-48F2-BE3C-FEAAEF9D0228}\\orsp budget tool.exe" update
5) Two media blocks were automatically defined and I set their URL to:
http://.../Software/ORSP Budget Tool.exe
and
http://.../Software/Microsoft MDAC Refresh 2.8 with Service Pack 1.zip (Changed the extension to .zip)
Non of them are set to be skipped.
6) Ran Web Based build
7) Uploaded files to website.
8) Ran Installation by entering http://.../Software/ORSP Budget Tool.exe in the Internet Explorer.
9) Installation ran without a problem.

Update setup:
1) Made a small change to executable (my application).
2) Left version as 1.0.0.0
3) Added "Update 1" with URL set to http://.../Software/ORSP Budget Tool.exe
and parameters: MODIFY=FALSE REMOVE=TRUE UNINSTALL=YES
4) Added version 1.0.0.0 in Web Updates and pointed it to "Update 1" update
5) Ran Web Based build
6) Uploaded media blocks and updates.txt to their corresponding web location (same as with initial setup replacing previous files).
7) Ran the Shortcut created in the initial installation to run setup. (Step 4)
8) Setup starts and appears to do something but nothing gets updated. My application executable is still the same old one.

I checked all the URL's by entering them in the Internet Explorer and the corresponding files download without a problem.

What am I doing wrong?

[Gizm0]

You MUST change the version number on the "to be updated" project, eitherwise is not detected.

[ccarras]

I made the following changes and the update still does not work:

In Update Setup:
2) Changed version to 1.0.0.1

Repeat step
7) Ran the Shortcut created in the initial installation to run setup. (Step 4)


Setup starts and appears to do something but nothing gets updated. My application executable is still the same old one.

Could you indicate in the steps that I listed what needs to be changed?

Thanks

[Gizm0]

Please search the forum, there are a lot of examples (and many by me) that explain how Web Update works.

[ccarras]

Could you point me to one "topic" where an example is given?
Believe me, I have searched but have not been able to find a detailed example.
I have been able to find solutions to problems like mine, but the solutions that are given most of the time require a change in the MSI code to which I do not have access since I am using the express version.
Besides, I found out that I am not the only one requesting a detailed example. I have come accross several recent posts that requests detailed examples but usually the reply comes in the form of changes to the setup.

[ccarras]

Could anybody answer to this post?
A detailed example like the one you have on your website for the .net installations would help enormously.

I do not think I am the only one that could benefit with this.

[RobertKozak]

I gave up on WebUpdates. It looked like it had potential but the lack of documentation is disappointing.

If someone does come out with a clear concise guide then I may look into it again but as of right now I decided to stay away from this "Feature".

-- Robert Kozak

[Gizm0]

I really can't get what is so difficult.. Besides, we are here to help, not build your setups, so please don't exploit our kindness. We're supposed to help on Technical problems you might have, not create your setups. Anyway, the steps are crystal and simple:

1) You must run the script with /update parameter, not just "update" after the full exe path (i just saw that).
2) If you have set version 1.0.0.0 as your version product number, then you have to create an update package (name it whatever you like) and also on the Updates panel, add new update, set version number to 1.0.0.0 and select the available update packages on the left.
3) Compile your project, update your new installer (the url you gave on your update pack) and replace your update.ini with the new one.
4) Run the old project with /update parameter and follow the instructions on screen.

I've done a million times, it worked every single time, so being sarcastic about a "feature" (like Robert did) is simple not fair. If you didn't understand how it works, it doesn't mean that it doesn't work actually.

Forgive my temper but i really don't like blaming products and "lack of documentation" because either you didn't invest time on learning the product (which it really has small learning curve) or you just make mistakes during the process. There are a lot of customers using WebUpdate feature without a single glitch and so do i. Feel free to ask any further questions.

[ccarras]

Maybe you should have responded in private to Mr. Kozak if you had any problems with what he said.

I do not believe I was ever impolite. I never asked you to build my Setup. I did read several times the instructions on setup but missed, just like you did in my post, the “/” before setup.

You missed the fact that I did not put the “/” before setup. Does that mean that you did not invest some time in carefully reading my post? I really do think that is the case because you are still asking me to compile my setup when I have repeatedly stated that I have the Express version that does not have the compile feature.

The fact that you have a lot of customers that have successfully used Web Updates means nothing. For example in my case if I had not created the “Update” shortcut in my installation, I would have never had to ask you for support. My installation would have work without a problem.

The fact that there are still many people posting questions and asking you for a detailed, step by step, example should mean something to you. It means that there is people that are still having problems; period. And it does no mean they are stupid or lazy maybe you are explaining things in a way that makes perfect sense to you and many of your customers, but not to everybody. There are billions of people in this world and fortunately every one of them thinks, analyzes and views things in very different ways.

So please, control your temper and help your customers.

[MichaelNesmith]

We acknowledge the lack of examples around web updates and are working to create some step by step guides to alleviate this problem.

However, the process really is quite simple. Be sure to read the help file topics for the Update Packs and Versions design views. They already provide basic step-by-step instructions to get your updates going.

[ccarras]

Thanks Michael.
Web Updates is working perfectly now.

[RobertKozak]

I've done a million times, it worked every single time, so being sarcastic about a "feature" (like Robert did) is simple not fair. If you didn't understand how it works, it doesn't mean that it doesn't work actually.

Forgive my temper but i really don't like blaming products and "lack of documentation" because either you didn't invest time on learning the product (which it really has small learning curve) or you just make mistakes during the process. There are a lot of customers using WebUpdate feature without a single glitch and so do i. Feel free to ask any further questions.

I applogize if you thought my post was rude or insensitive. I am no dummy when it comes to automatic updates because I wrote three commercial quality update programs in the past three years using three different techiques. I understand all of the issues that can arise with trying to update an installed product on an end users machine. It sounds simple but it is really a rather complex operation. After researching this topic over the past few years I can say that I am an expert on the subject.

And I do appreciate the steps you provided but they don't really help me since we aren't doing simple installs from the IDE. We are a large operation and our various teams are creating new updates for our various customers on a weekly basis. I am not going get into all the details here but the webupdates functionality is not that sophisticated. True I can change the Update script (which I looked into but the updates would only work some of the time.) but in order to provide all the update functionality that we require I would much rather write it in a real language and programming environment.

Again I am sorry if you took offense. I hope this helps you see where I am coming from.

--
Robert Kozak
Senior Software Architect

[Gizm0]

I've done a million times, it worked every single time, so being sarcastic about a "feature" (like Robert did) is simple not fair. If you didn't understand how it works, it doesn't mean that it doesn't work actually.

Again I am sorry if you took offense. I hope this helps you see where I am coming from.

--
Robert Kozak
Senior Software Architect

No hard feelings, i might over reacted too, but it's like someone telling you "you know, your product is junk" (at least it looked like this). You get the meaning anyway..

You're absolutely right. In very complex situations, you might need a custom solution to do updates, BUT InstallAWARE can do everything. So if you have time, you can create a trully sophisticated update script/engine. If you need help or assistance, feel free to contact me in person at pkefal (at) installaware (dot) com

[MichaelNesmith]

Hi Robert,

By providing you general purpose tools, such as a task scheduler, tray icon notifications, and such, we believe InstallAware contains everything you need out-of-the-box to build intelligent update clients. And the default behavior for the update client script is to emulate Windows Update itself, which we believe will provide the most familiar end-user experience for the majority of users out there.

Again, the update client script reliably works, most of the problems are misunderstandings about the update mechanism, which we hope to alleviate with a new step-by-step guide. Also most of the time, downloaded updates are improperly authored, which leads to "nothing happened when my update was downloaded" sort of complaints. Again we acknowledge that the lack of a step-by-step guide can make things confusing, but this is all basic behavior which is well documented in the help files, and reliably works all the time when correctly authored.

Of course, if you want to use fancy techniques to serve your updates, for update client notifications, and so on; you may be better off just building your own update clients from the ground up. Ultimately InstallAware helps you even with that by letting you build plug-ins for the MSIcode script in your favorite language. InstallAware is a setup authoring tool and as such can and should never match full blown programming languages; but it is our hope that we have given you the tools to dramatically simplify your setup - and update - authoring.

[RobertKozak]

I did like what I saw with your update functionality but when I could not get it working reliably after reading the help, and reading every thread on this forum I could find I got very frustrated. Eespecially since I should know how to do this because, like I said, I wrote three different update mechanisms from the ground up. Its not like I don't understand the basics.

Thanks in advance for your guide. I am looking forward to it.

--
Robert Kozak